WEBVTT 1 00:00:04.610 --> 00:00:29.360 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Hello, everybody! Welcome to our third day of romance writers Week. We have an amazing panel discussion up for you very soon. But I'm just going to let everybody come on in from the room now. It seems like we've got a bunch of different people pouring in before we get started as always. If you can see and hear me, just to make sure everything is working. Can you please drop in the chat 2 00:00:29.360 --> 00:00:36.490 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: your name can tell me where you're from. And also, if you have a favorite romance book that you have read 3 00:00:36.560 --> 00:00:39.900 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: in the last, let's say, is 6, 3 to 6 months. 4 00:00:40.760 --> 00:00:49.849 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Hello! From New Hampshire, Belgium, England. Hey, Linda? Almost good evening it is 3 pm. So middle of the afternoon. 5 00:00:50.910 --> 00:00:54.009 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Hi, Brittany! Hi! Amy Hi Karen. 6 00:00:56.420 --> 00:00:59.940 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: 8 A. M. For Marissa. So nice and early. Hi, Sarah! 7 00:01:01.370 --> 00:01:06.010 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Lots of London folks here. We've got a lot of London people on our panel as well. 8 00:01:06.670 --> 00:01:19.330 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Essie is loving. Bk. Boris and love light farms. Katie loves Lucy Score and Susan Elizabeth Phillips. Laura just read. We could be so good by cat. Sebastian 9 00:01:19.490 --> 00:01:24.020 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: need to print this chat, so I make sure I have all of the recommendations 10 00:01:24.560 --> 00:01:31.129 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: hope recently read Ugly Love by Colleen Hoover. I saw people we meet on vacation here, which I 11 00:01:31.320 --> 00:01:41.569 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: recently learned. So I moved to the UKA couple years ago. People we made on vacation as one of my favorite books. But here it's called you and me on vacation. So I was confused because I was looking for it and couldn't find it. 12 00:01:41.940 --> 00:01:57.239 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Okay, great. It seems like everything is working here. So I'm going to just run through a few quick bits of housekeeping before I turn this over to our panelists so welcome everybody to romance writers. Week 2024 couple of quick bits of housekeeping. 13 00:01:57.440 --> 00:02:25.710 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: First, the replay for this session, and all of the other sessions are added to our hub page as soon as they're done. Processing processing has been pretty quick throughout this week, so we're trying to get them up same day, but usually they'll be added same day or by the morning after, just depending on how quickly they're processed. They are available for everybody for one week after the event until actually excuse me, that's 2 weeks until March first, and then after that day the replays are available for premium and premium pro members only a writing aid. 14 00:02:26.380 --> 00:02:50.690 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: If you are interested this week we are offering 25% off pro writing aid premium or premium pro yearly subscriptions, you will get a number of different features with that, including premium tools for authors, the ability to improve entire scenes through in depth, genre specific reports, and then a bunch of different options to customize your editing this offer also ends on March first, and you can find that on the hub as well 15 00:02:51.120 --> 00:03:15.940 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: upgrading to premium will also get you access to our Friday session. So our sessions on Monday, through Thursday of this week are free for everyone. And our sessions on Friday are going to be for premium and premium pro members. Only the sessions on Friday are going to be a bit more hands-on. So we're actually going to do some writing and work with the work with you and a couple of different exercises. So it's going to be a really great fun shorter day. If you would like access 16 00:03:15.940 --> 00:03:24.710 access to that content, you just need to upgrade to premium or premium pro by Friday, and you can do that with any of our subscription levels so monthly, yearly, or lifetime. 17 00:03:25.810 --> 00:03:54.380 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: And then please feel free to join us in the community with your providing aid login, if you have any questions, or want to keep chatting after the events. and then finally, for this session, please make sure that you're using the Q. And a box. If you have questions for any of our speakers, as we all know, the chat tends to move really quickly. So if you'd like to chat with other viewers. Please feel free to use the chat. But if you have questions for our panelists, please use the Q&A button as that's going to help make sure they can keep track of all of the questions coming in. 18 00:03:55.340 --> 00:04:08.569 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: I think that is everything. So with that I am going to stop sharing my screen, and I am going to turn this over to Virginia and our panel of authors here. Welcome to everyone! 19 00:04:09.940 --> 00:04:10.950 Frances Mensah Williams: Aye. 20 00:04:11.440 --> 00:04:12.520 Frances Mensah Williams: oh, really. 21 00:04:13.940 --> 00:04:24.109 Virginia Heath: Hi, everybody! I'm Virginia Heath. I'm gonna be your host for this panel. I'll apologize for the London accent. It's a hundred percent genuine. 22 00:04:24.130 --> 00:04:45.609 Virginia Heath: And I'll also apologize for the mountains of sarcastic British humor that you're going to be subjected to during this panel, because we're all brits but first of all. Let's go around and let's see who our lovely panelists are. And I'm gonna go with my screen. So we're gonna start with the wonderful Carrie, else, Carrie, tell us a bit about yourself. 23 00:04:45.800 --> 00:04:54.630 Carrie Elks: Hello, everyone. My name is Carrie Elks, and I live just outside London. Uk. I am a contemporary romance author. 24 00:04:54.790 --> 00:05:00.369 Carrie Elks: and I am the author of, I think, about 32 books. My most recent release is 25 00:05:00.750 --> 00:05:12.289 Virginia Heath: strictly not yours, which, released at the end of January, and is going pretty well. Hope that's everything. Do I have to sign anything else? No, that's perfect. Thank you. Now I'm going to move across to Sue Moorcroft. 26 00:05:12.750 --> 00:05:42.009 Sue Moorcroft: Hi, everybody! I'm Symocroft. I write 2 contemporary romantic novels a year for Avon Harp, Collins, a summer Book, and a winter book. So my last book was the Christmas love letters, and the next one doesn't come out till May, which is called under a summer sky. It's the first of a trilogy, which is something a bit new for me, and although I was brought up around the around Europe because I was an army kid, I settled in Northamptonshire, which is pretty much in the middle of England 27 00:05:42.960 --> 00:06:10.169 Virginia Heath: brilliant, and I should add here that actually all 5 of us are members of the romantic Novelist Association here in the Uk. Which is a association for writers of romance or or books with love stories in them. And we you can join from anywhere in the world, and the lovely Sue Moorcroft is also our president of that. So I thought, mentioned that there, okay, let's head now to Francis Mensa Williams. Tell us a bit about yourself, Francis. 28 00:06:10.510 --> 00:06:21.920 Frances Mensah Williams: Hi, everybody! This is gonna be amazing. So I'm here in London, North West London, to be precise and I write romantic fiction. Contemporary. 29 00:06:22.090 --> 00:06:35.849 Frances Mensah Williams: I think probably, what slightly different this is. Some of my books, especially in Ghana, in Africa, as well as in London and in the Uk. Generally. So I've been writing. I've been published since 2,015, and I've published 30 00:06:36.030 --> 00:06:38.930 Frances Mensah Williams: 9 novels. Now. So 31 00:06:39.300 --> 00:06:42.620 Frances Mensah Williams: Patrick, 7 and 2 nonfiction 9 books. 32 00:06:42.920 --> 00:06:50.400 Virginia Heath: Okay. Have you got your copy of your latest? A flash up front? Oh, my latest is called strictly friends. 33 00:06:50.410 --> 00:06:53.719 Frances Mensah Williams: and it came out last year, and I'm working on the next one 34 00:06:53.730 --> 00:06:54.960 Virginia Heath: so brilliant. 35 00:06:55.430 --> 00:07:02.069 Virginia Heath: and finally last, but by no means least, lease the wonderful Leila Raffi. Leila, introduce yourself. 36 00:07:02.510 --> 00:07:23.129 Laila Rafi: Hello, everybody! My name is Leila, and I write contemporary romantic comedies, and I am all of one book old, and my book came out in 2022. I don't have a Co. A copy with me. My mum's gone on holiday, and she took the only copy I had, so I'm sharing it for you on the screen. Oh, thanks, Virginia. 37 00:07:23.190 --> 00:07:25.789 Laila Rafi: and this came out in 2022. 38 00:07:26.130 --> 00:07:27.700 Virginia Heath: And what sort of book is it? 39 00:07:27.760 --> 00:07:34.499 Laila Rafi: So it's a contemporary romantic comedy set in present day, London with the British Asian characters. 40 00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:36.070 Virginia Heath: Splendid. 41 00:07:36.700 --> 00:08:04.810 Virginia Heath: Okay, so that's who we are. And obviously we're all. Oh, I should probably tell you who I am, shouldn't I? Yes, and well, I am a director of the Romantic Novice Association, but I am also Virginia Heath. I write mostly for the American market, but my books are available globally. I write what I like to call Regency. ROM comes with a little bit of spice, and my upcoming releases also in love and war which comes out in the spring. 42 00:08:05.540 --> 00:08:22.239 Virginia Heath: There we go. That's me. Okay, so obviously, we're here from the romantic novelist association. And so love stories are something that we all care passionately about. So I'm gonna start with Leila. What do you love about writing a love story? 43 00:08:23.020 --> 00:08:47.739 Laila Rafi: The first and foremost, I love reading it, and the feeling I get from reading it is just warm and fuzzy, and that great sense of satisfaction, so that sort of spurred me on to write it, and that feeling is that much more amplified and intensified when you actually write it, because you go through the emotions with each character on a completely different level. So I just can't imagine writing anything else like. That's why I love writing. Romance 44 00:08:48.140 --> 00:08:49.870 Virginia Heath: did carry 45 00:08:50.740 --> 00:08:59.250 Carrie Elks: I think that love is kind of part of the human condition. There are a few things you can guarantee, what experience in life but taxes. 46 00:08:59.310 --> 00:09:15.740 Carrie Elks: Nobody wants to write about taxes. And love is kind of the thing we do wanna write about and I know that whenever I read a book, even if it's not a romance book, it's the love story, even if it's subplot that usually gets me. There's just something about romance that makes me happy. 47 00:09:16.640 --> 00:09:18.300 Virginia Heath: brilliant. So 48 00:09:18.870 --> 00:09:28.520 Sue Moorcroft: well, very much like like Leila and Carrie. I just like to be in that world of love, and I think it's a bit like it's kind of a way 49 00:09:28.540 --> 00:09:40.780 Sue Moorcroft: to have an affair without upsetting my marriage, because it all kind of happens up here, and I think it's a lovely experience to fall in love, and I get to do it twice a year. 50 00:09:41.130 --> 00:09:52.440 Virginia Heath: Fantastic that, you know. That's one of the best answers I've ever heard without actually having one. Francis, why do you? I love that I love that see that's so special. 51 00:09:52.470 --> 00:10:13.050 Frances Mensah Williams: I do know. I love telling stories and love features somewhere in everything we talk about all the time, and you know one loves not great in real life. It's great to write stories and love that perfect in love land. So that's another good reason to get up there. And I think for me also, to be honest, I love telling stories that 52 00:10:13.060 --> 00:10:16.270 Frances Mensah Williams: put women of color at the center. And just 53 00:10:16.590 --> 00:10:24.459 Frances Mensah Williams: I change, you know, just to have a little bit more nuance and a little bit more variety in some of the stories that we read. 54 00:10:24.760 --> 00:10:35.780 Virginia Heath: Well, that's actually, that's actually a really perfect segue cause. I was just about to ask you. It's been a big push in the last couple of years on both sides of the Atlantic. 55 00:10:36.060 --> 00:10:37.730 Virginia Heath: to to make 56 00:10:37.820 --> 00:10:49.390 Virginia Heath: love stories much more diverse in with the representation of who the main characters are, in your opinion. How far have publishes come with diverse stories? 57 00:10:50.610 --> 00:10:57.520 Frances Mensah Williams: Well, do you know this is such a such an interesting question, and I've I've written and talked about it a lot. Because 58 00:10:57.830 --> 00:11:17.150 Frances Mensah Williams: I think in the Us. I think that's much further ahead with centering women of color in their books, that romance stories, and we are in the Uk. And if I think of my own experience, you know, I started writing this novel ages and ages ago, and just trying to get publishers or agents interested in 59 00:11:17.310 --> 00:11:24.190 Frances Mensah Williams: regular black professional woman, doing her thing, falling in love, having conflict and 60 00:11:24.690 --> 00:11:29.280 Frances Mensah Williams: sort of not having it seen as a specialist book or a special category. 61 00:11:29.360 --> 00:11:36.790 Frances Mensah Williams: Was was really challenging. And despite what a lot of publishers say about we're looking for diversity. 62 00:11:37.290 --> 00:11:45.760 Frances Mensah Williams: If they don't really get it, or they don't think they know how to sell it. Then it becomes a oh, we really like the story, but it's not quite for us. 63 00:11:45.820 --> 00:11:53.719 Frances Mensah Williams: So I think that was something I came across a lot. And yeah, my first publisher was a publisher that was set up specifically 64 00:11:53.800 --> 00:12:09.049 Frances Mensah Williams: to target writers that were under represented in mainstream fiction, and I was really fortunate. I got a publishing deal with them, and that's how my first novel from pastor to pig foot. Got picked up and and published. So since then 65 00:12:09.730 --> 00:12:19.900 Frances Mensah Williams: it's been interesting, and I think, after 2020 we saw a huge expansion in interest in writing by black people, but it was a lot of it was really performative. 66 00:12:20.190 --> 00:12:21.690 Frances Mensah Williams: And you know there's 67 00:12:21.720 --> 00:12:39.209 Frances Mensah Williams: it. It's quite funny, because I went to watch American fiction the movie the other day. And it's it's actually up for us to best picture. And it's this parody on, you know, black writer who writes good writing, and no one wants to read it until he writes caricature stuff. That's really one dimensional. And suddenly he's a best seller. 68 00:12:39.470 --> 00:12:45.529 Frances Mensah Williams: and I was squirming a bit. When I was watching this movie, I said to my daughter, this is a bit close to the phone for me. 69 00:12:45.820 --> 00:12:46.950 Virginia Heath: Yeah. 70 00:12:47.180 --> 00:12:54.779 Frances Mensah Williams: but I think you know we have a way to go. We have a way to go. There was the survey in the Uk. And 2020 that said that 71 00:12:55.000 --> 00:13:06.110 Frances Mensah Williams: publishes in the UK. Right for a particular core audience, which is white middle class readers. So I think as long as that remains the benchmark, you gonna really find that. 72 00:13:06.120 --> 00:13:09.150 Frances Mensah Williams: you know, writers of color will struggle that much more 73 00:13:09.190 --> 00:13:20.169 Frances Mensah Williams: because we're not special interest, right? It's not only people of color that read our books, you know, it's mainstream, and I think for me that's really important to try and support them, to keep 74 00:13:20.180 --> 00:13:36.399 Virginia Heath: pushing. I think very much that you are right about the UK. Lagging behind substantially, I mean by main markets in America, and the the things I'm seeing in American bookshops are so much more 75 00:13:36.480 --> 00:13:54.389 Virginia Heath: well, what's encouraging than they are in the Uk. I think Uk book stalls are very lazy when it comes to marketing romance. Maybe that's just me, but I think they pick up the next big thing from tick tock. They don't look at local, and by local I mean the people in their own country writing about their own 76 00:13:54.810 --> 00:14:00.969 Virginia Heath: countrymen's experience as a, as a you know, non-white author, I mean. 77 00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:13.039 Virginia Heath: despite the drive, and I think the drive at the moment. Personally, I think the drive is. Is them trying to catch up and not quite knowing what they're doing or how to catch up. 78 00:14:13.370 --> 00:14:17.250 Virginia Heath: I swing this over to Leila, because this obviously affects you as well. 79 00:14:17.860 --> 00:14:27.849 Virginia Heath: How hard is it to sell diverse stories in the marketplace at the moment? I'm not just talking about with publishes, but sales as well. How hard is it to sell those books? 80 00:14:29.010 --> 00:14:30.579 Laila Rafi: I think 81 00:14:31.060 --> 00:15:00.369 Laila Rafi: I'll use France's point, and just off the back of that it's more, I think, case of the marketing that's not necessarily aiming it at the right readers, or marketing it in a way that tells you that while it's a diverse story, is still a romance, and I can only obviously speak about romance, because that's all I write. Is to sell it as a romance first and foremost, because that is what it is. Anything else is just a nuance that we add as as writers 82 00:15:00.480 --> 00:15:13.369 Laila Rafi: to it. Personally, I've not found it as difficult to be honest, because I've only recently started writing, and when I put in my first manuscript I got picked up straight away. 83 00:15:13.610 --> 00:15:20.990 Laila Rafi: I was quite lucky in that, but the main reason I got picked up was because it was I was writing about people of color 84 00:15:21.180 --> 00:15:39.100 Laila Rafi: and the the from that community as well. Yeah, that's it. I am British, Asian and I was writing about British Asian characters, and the editor, who also happened to be British Asian. She was like, this is exactly what we want. So you know, let's go forward with it. So I was actually very, very lucky. 85 00:15:39.360 --> 00:16:00.229 Laila Rafi: And from there on I've found a really really positive reception to any time I've spoken to publishers, so I've not had that kind of personal experience about it being difficult. I have to be honest, but I can see how may, in terms of mainstream and commercially. I don't see that kind of 86 00:16:00.350 --> 00:16:14.559 Laila Rafi: scope for our books. They're they're not out there visible for people to see, and when I think of whose book I see mine next to on a bookshelf. I can't think of that. Many British Asian authors as I can American Asian authors. 87 00:16:14.870 --> 00:16:20.080 Laila Rafi: There is definitely a much bigger market out there for 88 00:16:20.170 --> 00:16:28.050 Laila Rafi: for those kinds of books than here, so I wasn't even sure where to place mine. To be honest when I first put it out, so it is difficult. 89 00:16:28.070 --> 00:16:33.089 Laila Rafi: but I think it ultimately for me it was probably a case of right time, right place. 90 00:16:33.810 --> 00:16:36.010 Virginia Heath: Okay? So now I wanna 91 00:16:36.260 --> 00:17:00.559 Virginia Heath: I wanna move on a little bit. And and we're here, obviously with pro writing aid. And everybody who's using this software, I'm guessing has a joy of writing. And is intending to, or is already published. So I wanted to talk a little bit. Now twist the conversation a little bit to the organization that the 5 of us all belong to which is the romantic novelist Association. 92 00:17:00.660 --> 00:17:03.779 Virginia Heath: and actually 93 00:17:04.160 --> 00:17:05.460 Virginia Heath: to 94 00:17:05.660 --> 00:17:20.580 Virginia Heath: to kind of talk about how that has maybe helped you. Think first of you. First of all, let's go around. How many of you started your writing journey on the romantic novelist associations? 95 00:17:20.780 --> 00:17:23.149 Virginia Heath: Wonderful new writers. Scheme. 96 00:17:24.660 --> 00:17:33.969 Virginia Heath: Sue Leila. Okay, so Sue. Can I ask you to tell everybody a bit about it, and what it involves, and what you get for your money? 97 00:17:34.470 --> 00:17:50.500 Sue Moorcroft: Well, it's quite a while since I was on the new writers scheme, so it will have evolved. But I was in the early 2 thousands. I was on the new writers scheme. I heard about it at an event for short story writers, and I basically went home and joined straight up. 98 00:17:50.900 --> 00:18:02.780 Sue Moorcroft: So what it gave me. And I think this is still true, is II got a manuscript every year, critiqued by a published author in in my genre. 99 00:18:02.930 --> 00:18:17.029 Sue Moorcroft: So that's not like a one line essay. It's like a 6 page appraisal. insane sort of thing. As you'd get your edit notes from an editor, so it prepared me very well for 100 00:18:17.190 --> 00:18:33.620 Sue Moorcroft: signing a book and then want them wanting changes. Also, of course, access to all the Rna's wonderful parties and the conference and the online chapter has evolved several times since I joined it. 101 00:18:33.810 --> 00:18:37.329 Sue Moorcroft: And one of the most valuable things I found was having 102 00:18:38.070 --> 00:18:49.329 Sue Moorcroft: the opportunity to just fall into conversation with published authors. You know you'd be at the conference and in the queue for the lunch for lunch. You'd realize you were standing next to 103 00:18:49.490 --> 00:19:02.829 Sue Moorcroft: an author who you knew, who published 50 books, who maybe was a millionaire and they were just normal people with all the same worries as me. They did not have a special crown or anything like that. 104 00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:07.219 Sue Moorcroft: And I found there can do attitude 105 00:19:07.380 --> 00:19:09.090 Sue Moorcroft: rubbed off on me. 106 00:19:09.360 --> 00:19:20.190 Sue Moorcroft: The new writer's scheme. Coordinator was then Margaret Jane's, and she took a special interest in me and kind of mentored me unofficially. In that she 107 00:19:21.490 --> 00:19:32.669 Sue Moorcroft: told me a list of agents and editors who was suitable for what I wrote, and I got my first agent that way. Somebody from a big, low, long rig from a big London agency. 108 00:19:32.830 --> 00:19:38.449 Sue Moorcroft: And she put more. You put me forward for the Katy Ford Bursary, which I won. 109 00:19:39.950 --> 00:19:49.599 Virginia Heath: So that's how you started off. What about you, Leila? How you you're a graduate from the new Rogers game. How did it help you with your writing? 110 00:19:50.610 --> 00:20:11.029 Laila Rafi: It was. It gave me a great deal of confidence in my writing it. The new writer's scheme. The reader who read my manuscript and critiqued it for me prior to publication, told me what they liked about it what I was good at, rather than just things to improve which really boosted me confidence. It gave me that sort of you know 111 00:20:11.290 --> 00:20:37.739 Laila Rafi: that spark to be like, yeah, okay, I can do this. This. I'm not half bad at it. I can. I can make this work. And so I think that boosting confidence really helped me, and ultimately, as you said, it was the networking it was being able to speak to other people at various stages of their writing journey, sharing anecdotes, and speaking to people, and saying that I hear voices in my head, and them not thinking your bonus. That's really helpful. 112 00:20:37.740 --> 00:20:49.859 Virginia Heath: Ii should say to anybody out there if you're interested in joining the romantic novelist associations. New writer scheme to get an anonymous critique from from a published author of a full manuscript. 113 00:20:49.860 --> 00:21:02.020 Virginia Heath: But also to join the community, which is really lively. There's lots of training all sorts of online stuff. Then it's it literally opened a week ago for new members. And I think we've got about 10 spaces left. 114 00:21:02.030 --> 00:21:14.140 Virginia Heath: So if you head to the romantic novelist association website, and you're interested in that. We have every year we have at least 15 people graduate the scheme today. 115 00:21:14.330 --> 00:21:42.069 Virginia Heath: you know, published writers. So it really is an excellent thing for you to go in for. So now let's move on, and poor old Carrie's been sat there for a little while and and not said anything. And I'd like to talk about the different routes into writing and do you have quite a unique perspective on this panel because you're you are our most prolific hybrid author, and by hybrid you've been both indie and traditional. 116 00:21:42.070 --> 00:22:02.650 Carrie Elks: So can you briefly give us the pros and cons of both. Okay, yes, I'll I will try and be brief. I am mostly self published now. I was a mixture when I began I've been pu. I think I have 5 books that are traditionally published, one Standalone book and a series. 117 00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:17.170 Carrie Elks: and it it was a very up and down experience for me being traditionally published in that my first couple of books were well received, and then the rest kind of bombed, and I was not massively happy about it. So I decided to take the Self Publishing Route 118 00:22:17.200 --> 00:22:22.579 Carrie Elks: and main reasons for that was control. I wanted to have control of 119 00:22:22.620 --> 00:22:30.830 Carrie Elks: what I wrote my editing through an editor. The covers that I had when I release it, and most importantly, the marketing side of things. 120 00:22:30.890 --> 00:22:48.990 Carrie Elks: And so I started self publishing in earnest in 2019. And it's now been 5 years, and I think about 25 books. Later, I make these numbers up because I haven't sat down and counted for a while. I know there's more than 30 it's going really well for me, and 121 00:22:48.990 --> 00:23:06.339 Carrie Elks: I love having that control. I think we the amount of work that I do. I think I probably earn more. We don't like talking about money as writers, I know, but the money side of things has been great for me. Having the control of why, right? And when I publish has been great. 122 00:23:06.390 --> 00:23:26.799 Carrie Elks: and but it is a lot of hard work, too, so I effectively run my own publishing business. I have to deal with my contractors. IA lot of my work is marketing as well as writing, and I know from a marketing point of view that I have to write regularly, so I try to release around 4 books per year on top of everything else. I do. So it 123 00:23:27.250 --> 00:23:29.289 Carrie Elks: it's hard work, but worth it. 124 00:23:29.320 --> 00:23:48.849 Virginia Heath: Yeah, so I mean, it boggles me. II take my hat off to anybody who is a full time into the author, because they just I struggle enough, just getting the books written, let alone marketing them and translating them and all the other stuff that goes along with it. 125 00:23:49.250 --> 00:23:59.359 Virginia Heath: let's talk markets, then. We've got a few of you on the well. You're all apart from me who writes historical. You're all contemporary authors. 126 00:23:59.370 --> 00:24:10.739 Virginia Heath: So first of all, as a as a wholly tried author here in the Uk. What is the contemporary market like as far as your concerns? 127 00:24:11.220 --> 00:24:21.670 Sue Moorcroft: Well, there's always something in the lead. So at the moment it's romanticy, and all that stuff that comes from tick tock. Last year it was Colleen Hoover, which also came from tick tock. 128 00:24:21.950 --> 00:24:30.640 Sue Moorcroft: but behind it, as the mainstay, I think it's relatable stories with relatable characters, and they're living real life. 129 00:24:31.370 --> 00:24:41.219 Sue Moorcroft: All the good things of real life and all the bad things of real life, with all the conflicts and goals that come along with our daily lives, and then, in the midst of it, they fall in love. 130 00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:45.839 Sue Moorcroft: And I think that's kind of the mainstay. 131 00:24:45.900 --> 00:24:49.589 Sue Moorcroft: a lot of digital publishers in the UK. Now. 132 00:24:50.610 --> 00:24:59.849 Sue Moorcroft: even like my original or one of my older publishers, was acquired by joffy books this year, and they are digital first. So my 133 00:24:59.880 --> 00:25:02.409 Sue Moorcroft: paperbacks have gone print on demand. 134 00:25:02.500 --> 00:25:07.199 Sue Moorcroft: But what they've done to revitalize my back list is a good digital 135 00:25:07.320 --> 00:25:17.949 Sue Moorcroft: or Publishing Company. It's been astonishing, literally, my royalties for last half. That was the first half with Joff Joffe were 5 times 136 00:25:18.210 --> 00:25:20.610 Sue Moorcroft: what my royalty with the 137 00:25:20.690 --> 00:25:38.619 Sue Moorcroft: now. They're not my major publisher, Avon is. But still it gave me first hand experience of what everybody's talking about with the digital. First publishers, even though I'm with a very traditional publisher, and I'm very happy to come out in paperback most of the paperback so in the 138 00:25:38.720 --> 00:25:42.339 Sue Moorcroft: supermarket rather than shops that I write. 139 00:25:42.440 --> 00:26:01.530 Virginia Heath: I think that's something actually important to clarify to to anybody here. Watching over the pond is our book. Stores are way behind in America in their pro romance, pro love story stance and it. So actually here. 140 00:26:01.750 --> 00:26:27.529 Virginia Heath: digital publishing has kind of filled that void. And we've got several digital first lines, some of them owned by the Big 5 publishers, some of them wholly independent, that that market books by women for women with S so well that they actually don't need to worry about those those bookstores. So I just want to clarify what digital first here is doing. So well. 141 00:26:27.570 --> 00:26:33.299 Virginia Heath: how do you find the contemporary market at the moment, Carrie? Obviously, you're doing it from an indie perspective. 142 00:26:33.650 --> 00:26:47.089 Carrie Elks: Yeah, I mean, I don't really look just at the Uk as a market. So my main market is a bit like you. The Us. I think I sell around, say, 60 of my sales, the Us. And 40% Uk. 143 00:26:47.180 --> 00:27:12.810 Carrie Elks: little bit less because there's some other countries that are in between as well. And I'm really completely online sales. So I don't sell any of my books through bookshops at all. I do have my books available on catalog if book shops want to ward them, but it's literally everything is online sales, whether it be from Amazon, Barnes, and Noble, or any other bookshop that sells both hard paperbacks and 144 00:27:12.810 --> 00:27:26.550 Carrie Elks: ebooks. So I don't have this insight into what bookshops are looking for that some of you do because I don't have a publisher who's telling me any of that information as well. So. But what I do do is walk into bookshops. 145 00:27:26.580 --> 00:27:39.519 Carrie Elks: and I'm slowly beginning to see some change again. Tick Tock led book talk led Booktop made me buy it. Tables at the front of water stones. People like Lucy Score, who are really kind of opening up 146 00:27:39.630 --> 00:27:51.950 Carrie Elks: book sales, Colleen, Hoover, and Wang. Just a lot of names that probably started off more in the indie space and through book talk have have become more traditionally 147 00:27:52.170 --> 00:28:11.299 Virginia Heath: so focused authors. So that was a lot of information to say I don't know. And what about. Let's go back to France's the the contemporary diverse character market. I don't want to. I don't want to take it off to one side, but I think 148 00:28:11.350 --> 00:28:19.460 Virginia Heath: here in the UK. Very much, still is very much off to one side. Would you disagree with me. or am I being unfair there? 149 00:28:19.850 --> 00:28:22.989 Frances Mensah Williams: Oh, I don't think you're being unfair. 150 00:28:23.440 --> 00:28:27.989 Frances Mensah Williams: I think it. You know it's it's funny. You look at other 151 00:28:28.610 --> 00:28:30.530 Frances Mensah Williams: media. You look at 152 00:28:30.560 --> 00:28:40.830 Frances Mensah Williams: cinema, you know. Look at Black Panther, the the huge impact that made not just as a movie with black people in it. But as a commercially successful movie. 153 00:28:40.950 --> 00:28:53.530 Frances Mensah Williams: you look at television and Bridgeton. and how hugely the audiences came to watch that. And that's just because. you know, we need to kind of get away. And I hope the UK. Publishing industry 154 00:28:53.560 --> 00:29:04.559 Frances Mensah Williams: and just get away from this idea that books by people of color are special interest books. They're not that universal stories. They're about love, they're about pain, they're about 155 00:29:04.570 --> 00:29:11.600 Frances Mensah Williams: identity, they're about struggle, they're about joy. They're funny, you know. Everyone's going through the same 156 00:29:11.660 --> 00:29:27.740 Frances Mensah Williams: struggles and pain and joys, and some people have gone deeper suntan than others, right? But that's pretty much the difference. And you just need to move the thinking of the industry away from this idea that these niches mean anything. They really don't. 157 00:29:28.280 --> 00:29:40.459 Virginia Heath: I think that's an absolutely brilliant point. And II want to talk about the American market specifically, because both myself are in the American market. 158 00:29:40.560 --> 00:29:45.710 Virginia Heath: Carry in the indie space, me in the bookstore space and what I find 159 00:29:46.910 --> 00:30:06.570 Virginia Heath: I I've been to 19 states in America. So I'm I'm I'm talking in broad brush strokes. I can't talk about everywhere, and I've been to some places where I've noticed some differences. But what I love in American bookstores is that that idea of special interest, even down to genres, is very, very 160 00:30:06.760 --> 00:30:18.850 Virginia Heath: it's much more watered down, and that that doesn't matter. It's just this is a book that you might want to enjoy. And it, mo, you know you might like this person's voice. So, for example. 161 00:30:18.850 --> 00:30:43.389 Virginia Heath: I find myself with my you know my Regency Romcoms, on the same table as Colleen Hoover, or on the same table as Casey Mcquistan, with a red, white, and royal blue, or with a story with people of color as the main characters. It does seem to be much more of a melting pot. The romance market in America, and much more kind of 162 00:30:44.050 --> 00:30:50.380 Virginia Heath: vibrant and exciting as a result of it. Are you finding similar but American sales? 163 00:30:50.810 --> 00:31:01.660 Carrie Elks: Yeah, I've I've got a few friends. Who and obviously I visit America as well, I used to live in America, which is why most of my books are set in America. 164 00:31:02.940 --> 00:31:12.219 Carrie Elks: it's hard to tell when you're looking at Amazon online. I do think I do think that that with most things, that America is further along the line and we are 165 00:31:12.630 --> 00:31:14.750 Carrie Elks: at trying to push 166 00:31:15.360 --> 00:31:31.789 Carrie Elks: push these at these barriers. I guess we have, like ceilings, barriers, whatever we call them. But it's also a much bigger country, and probably has more money in the publishing industry than we have, and our job is to persuade 167 00:31:31.820 --> 00:31:44.719 Carrie Elks: publishers. But actually, we do want to read these books. Because I do. And and and, as you said, Bridgeton, what what I mean? Fantastic show that was based on books that that weren't about people of 168 00:31:44.970 --> 00:31:52.090 Carrie Elks: diversity and and people of color, and then suddenly changing things, and for the better, I think so. 169 00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:52.980 Virginia Heath: Hmm! 170 00:31:53.360 --> 00:32:04.499 Frances Mensah Williams: I am seeing it slowly in the indie market. But again it's it's a few people. It's not enough people in the States. I think. You know, women of color, black women writers. 171 00:32:05.000 --> 00:32:14.620 Frances Mensah Williams: Asian American women rights is really made the mark, and they've got a huge following, and it's a big niche area of publishing now. 172 00:32:14.920 --> 00:32:20.859 Frances Mensah Williams: And I think that indie drive is always what brings the traditional publishers following afterwards. 173 00:32:20.960 --> 00:32:26.159 Frances Mensah Williams: So we don't have the numbers here in the Uk in the same way, by any stretch. 174 00:32:26.360 --> 00:32:28.480 Frances Mensah Williams: So I think that's probably why 175 00:32:28.880 --> 00:32:43.489 Virginia Heath: all the support and I don't. It's and this is it's widespread. The romance genre in the Uk is not respected enough, which brings me nice and neatly, I think, to 176 00:32:44.960 --> 00:33:00.429 Virginia Heath: The romantic Novelist Association for the last couple of years have been doing work with the hashtag respectrom thick. And it's it's kind of a bit of calling out when calling out is required, and somebody 177 00:33:00.430 --> 00:33:19.350 Virginia Heath: usually mail usually high up in in publishing or or high up in writing who is disparaging about a genre that we correct them. But also it's it's become a real force for positive change as well where we're we're promoting it. So 178 00:33:21.040 --> 00:33:46.490 Virginia Heath: let's go to Sue. Now who's who's probably been writing longer than the rest of us here, cause she she can talk about the changes with romance now, arguably, and if you add everything in that, the the publishers don't include his romance, obviously are with romance. Now, arguably the the biggest seller here in the Uk. Why do you think it's still looked down upon in certain circles? 179 00:33:47.300 --> 00:33:53.400 Sue Moorcroft: Well, wouldn't it be nice to know? Mostly we. I think it's about perception. 180 00:33:53.600 --> 00:34:05.010 Sue Moorcroft: I think that love is perceived as silly, all weak sometimes, whereas in real life it's not, is it? It's one of the biggest decisions we make is literally who we're in bed with. 181 00:34:05.220 --> 00:34:09.560 Sue Moorcroft: Who we spend our lives with. I hope it's not misogyny. 182 00:34:09.650 --> 00:34:24.800 Sue Moorcroft: but I've heard you say a couple of times. This session, I think, Virginia, written by women for women. I hope it's not that but we're only women on this panel because we don't have that many male writers in 183 00:34:24.989 --> 00:34:36.889 Sue Moorcroft: in our. In our genre. It does seem to be about about women. It's weird, because commercially we are so successful. And this is why, finally, we're beginning to see some romantic fiction 184 00:34:38.550 --> 00:34:46.310 Sue Moorcroft: in places like water stones, although they feel they have to hang it on something else. And I went to the last respect. ROM fick 185 00:34:46.590 --> 00:35:08.480 Sue Moorcroft: meeting, and some of the events that are coming up our embargoed. I can't talk about them except say the Rna is going to be at love stories, etc., and I shall be there representing the Rna. That's one of the events. But shortly yeah. July thirteenth, I think. 186 00:35:08.660 --> 00:35:13.450 Virginia Heath: There are other events coming up, and there is a book store involved. 187 00:35:13.680 --> 00:35:28.980 Sue Moorcroft: so I think that it's weird that with Dili Court, who is a saga writer so firmly in the Thema code of romance and saga, she is at Number one this week in the whole of the Uk. 188 00:35:29.740 --> 00:35:32.990 Sue Moorcroft: And yet, when the British book awards were announced. 189 00:35:33.250 --> 00:35:58.930 Sue Moorcroft: is there a romantic prize a prize for romantic fiction. No, there is not. There is one for crime and thriller, and there's one for audio book and stuff like that. But there is not one for romantic fiction, and I think when I saw the editor at The Hopper Colin summer party, and armed with a couple of glasses of wine, I did button. Hold him about this, and he gave me to his female colleague to talk to 190 00:35:59.160 --> 00:36:10.020 Sue Moorcroft: she agreed with me that she was not allowed to discriminate against me, according to my sexual orientation, or my language, or my religion, or my color. 191 00:36:10.230 --> 00:36:16.239 Sue Moorcroft: up to there they are discriminating against us because of what we write, and she agreed with it all, and nothing 192 00:36:16.570 --> 00:36:25.140 Sue Moorcroft: changed at all. But I think it is changing. I think it is getting better. I was 11 years on the 193 00:36:25.200 --> 00:36:46.369 Sue Moorcroft: what was then the committee of the Rna. It's a board now, and it was a constant problem. We used to say, how do we turn the tanker, and I have seen improvements. There are more people accepting that they write romantic fiction. They don't tend to be male. I can think of a couple who I think, ought to be in romance and saga 194 00:36:46.440 --> 00:37:06.980 Virginia Heath: and they're not. They're putting general fiction for a commercial reason, which is cynical. Really, I think as well. If I look at the respect from fiction movement, and I look at like the movers and Shakers within it. Outside of the Rna the publishers involved. 195 00:37:06.980 --> 00:37:30.079 Virginia Heath: It's the female as it is. We had don't have a single male editor on that, promoting it, pushing it, not one. It's it's all females and here in the Uk. The commissioning sort of editors and agents all seem to be female for our genres as well, and it is, it's kind of like we've been putting this little box. 196 00:37:30.220 --> 00:37:33.659 Virginia Heath: This is this, and and and stay there. But 197 00:37:33.770 --> 00:37:39.269 Virginia Heath: we're not gonna stay there, are we? So why is being the president of the Rna important to you? 198 00:37:40.820 --> 00:37:56.550 Virginia Heath: Well, it's an amazing accolade. When Jean rang me and offered it to me, I honestly thought she was sounding me out for one of my friends. To be invited and I was trying to guess I was trying to get ahead of her, and she said, No, it's you. 199 00:37:56.720 --> 00:38:06.369 Sue Moorcroft: So that was a big shock, because I joined the Rna around the year 2,000. So I'm coming up to quarter of a century. Now it helped me through the new right to scheme. 200 00:38:06.410 --> 00:38:18.750 Sue Moorcroft: I've made an amazing contact during my time on the committee I don't have. I don't do a job like Virginia does at the moment, with lots of work attached. I represent the Association. 201 00:38:18.780 --> 00:38:35.790 Sue Moorcroft: and thereby I represent romantic fiction. I did a library event the other day, and somebody said, What do you do? And I said, Well, I don't. I don't do much work. To be honest, I kind of waft around, but I do try and put forward romantic fiction wherever I can. 202 00:38:35.950 --> 00:38:53.360 Sue Moorcroft: And the positives, and how happy it makes people, and how rich it does make some people cause. It is a very, very commercial Shauna. And she said, What a lovely job! So I guess that's what it means to me. It's a lovely job. And it's a great honor to represent the association that's being just. 203 00:38:53.480 --> 00:39:00.599 Sue Moorcroft: ma massive in my career. I don't think that I would have got anywhere without the Rna. Let alone to where I have gone. 204 00:39:00.860 --> 00:39:30.639 Virginia Heath: Yeah, that's a really lovely answer. Now reminds it to anybody that if you've got any questions I'm going to be coming to the questions shortly in around about 10 min. Not maybe not even that. Can you please, if you've got any questions for our panel today, put them in the QA. Box, not the chat box, because there's over a hundred messages in the chat box and 14 in the QA. And that's the one I'm going to first. 205 00:39:30.800 --> 00:39:38.879 Virginia Heath: So let's let's talk about the Rna. Then let's go to Francis. What do you love about the Rna? 206 00:39:39.680 --> 00:39:48.209 Frances Mensah Williams: Okay, yeah. I was just going to to follow up on Sue's comments. But first of all, I think it's great that there is an association that has the 207 00:39:48.430 --> 00:40:01.550 Frances Mensah Williams: romance and fiction in there, because it's hard work, and it's not easy to write. We're talking about going into people's psyches, their motivations, their minds, their emotions. 208 00:40:01.710 --> 00:40:04.710 Frances Mensah Williams: the complex baggage that they often carry with them. 209 00:40:04.730 --> 00:40:14.779 Frances Mensah Williams: and in all of that telling a story that keeps the reader going. So it's not easy, and it's great that there is an association because it validates what we do. And it says 210 00:40:14.990 --> 00:40:21.210 Frances Mensah Williams: we do this as professionals, and we have a professional association that stands there that proudly proclaims this. 211 00:40:21.320 --> 00:40:25.290 Frances Mensah Williams: I thought so. Writing is pretty solitary, so to be able to 212 00:40:25.960 --> 00:40:35.860 Frances Mensah Williams: meet with and have a community of writers that you can exchange information with, or just know they exist. And they're going through a lot of the stuff you are. I think that's been really helpful. 213 00:40:35.910 --> 00:41:00.310 Virginia Heath: Other people who have voices in their head and understand that doesn't make me mad. A little bit. History about the Rna. For those of you unaware of the Romantic Nobles Association, we are actually the largest rights in organization in the oldest right in organization in the Uk. We're over 60 years old now, and and we're still going strong. 214 00:41:00.310 --> 00:41:09.810 Virginia Heath: We. We have a very varied membership now, but we are still predominantly women. So if there's any. 215 00:41:10.190 --> 00:41:19.420 Virginia Heath: not women out there that would love to join, we'd love to have you so let's ask the same question to Carrie. 216 00:41:19.760 --> 00:41:21.630 Virginia Heath: what do you love about the Rna? 217 00:41:21.930 --> 00:41:29.090 Carrie Elks: I love everything about the Rna. Obviously I joined in 2,015 when I had my first book published, and 218 00:41:29.400 --> 00:41:43.540 Carrie Elks: was very welcomed. And I think that's that's the beauty of the Rna. Is that it doesn't matter if you're a new writer. If you've written for years. People are very happy to see you, and I think a lot of that is because, as the others said, you know, it's a lonely job. 219 00:41:43.580 --> 00:42:08.880 Carrie Elks: and you can join your local chat as we can go at to meetings. So I am a member of my local chat term. We meet up once a month, you can go to the conference where you see so many more people. And I think this year I conferences Holloway, which I'm very excited about but more than anything, it's it's the support. So from a from a writing point of view, from A, you know, if someone's got problems with time. 220 00:42:08.880 --> 00:42:25.580 Carrie Elks: We can talk to each other. If we've got problems with a character, we can talk to each other, and we talk the same language that perhaps our partners and friends don't understand when we are crying, because our couple has just broken up and 221 00:42:25.640 --> 00:42:31.230 Carrie Elks: Our partners are looking at like where there's something wrong with us. But no, because we understand each other. 222 00:42:31.310 --> 00:42:58.219 Laila Rafi: Leila, what about you? What do you love about the Rna? I'm not sure I can add a lot more to that. It is just that sense of community that we have at the Rna. Last year I went to my first conference, and it felt I didn't feel like my first conference after the first 5 min. I have to say I it felt like I knew people coming up to me talking to me like they've known me forever. 223 00:42:58.220 --> 00:43:27.189 Laila Rafi: and I saw started doing the same. I found myself going up to people and trying to make them feel welcome, and I was always on your first time, you know. But it's that sense of community I've never honest to God, felt it anywhere else, as we do in the Rna, and that also comes down to the chapters as well similar to the chapter I go to. We meet up, I think, once every other month. And it's such a warm and friendly environment. We sit, we have a drink, we, you know, have a meal together. 224 00:43:27.190 --> 00:43:46.699 Laila Rafi: We'll talk a few things about our lives generally as well. There is support outside writing as well, which I really like. Yeah, I mean, there's an opportunity to learn with the Rna, which I find really really useful development as well. 225 00:43:47.120 --> 00:44:00.109 Virginia Heath: for anybody who's interested. You can join the romantic Novice association from anywhere in the world, because we do have a lively online community that you can talk to us with. I'm on Zoom. 226 00:44:00.650 --> 00:44:09.039 Virginia Heath: Oh, my dogs coming in. I'm very sorry. Audience, my dogs coming in. We have a very 227 00:44:09.240 --> 00:44:19.840 Virginia Heath: lively on online community. You can join in many ways if you are already published, whether India or trad, you can join as a full member. If you work 228 00:44:20.150 --> 00:44:30.280 Virginia Heath: providing services for writers or in publishing, you can join join as an associate member like I said, we've got a few spaces left on our new writers scheme which are like 229 00:44:30.650 --> 00:45:00.479 Virginia Heath: they are rarer than rarer than unicorn horns. And that is just. That is a route to publication with so much support built in for you. And then we also have a new category this year called aspiring member. Which means that you you can join. You get access to limited services, and but you get a feel for the community. See if it's like you. And if you're interested in any of those things, and please head to our website, which is Www. Dot 230 00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:10.820 Virginia Heath: romantic novelist association.org, and how I remembered that I honestly don't know. My apologies for my dog 231 00:45:10.850 --> 00:45:14.920 Virginia Heath: coming in here. I'm now going to go over to the QA. 232 00:45:15.050 --> 00:45:22.679 Virginia Heath: And so bear with me. I'm going to go all the way to the beginning, because I'm guessing that those people of white is. Oh. 233 00:45:23.230 --> 00:45:27.460 Virginia Heath: let's see scroll the wrong way there. Okay. 234 00:45:27.780 --> 00:45:47.320 Virginia Heath: someone here, I write historical romance. My work in progress is a seventeenth century story setting Canada any members here? Right? Historical fiction. Well, I do but I don't really know much about seventeenth century Canada so that might be something for the main chats as you can get to talking to those people 235 00:45:47.550 --> 00:45:57.370 Virginia Heath: and interesting one here, there's a couple of questions which which look very similar. It's going back onto writing diverse characters. 236 00:45:57.460 --> 00:46:03.549 Virginia Heath: And actually, what's very interesting, is it? This is 237 00:46:03.890 --> 00:46:07.590 Virginia Heath: any advice on basically 238 00:46:09.280 --> 00:46:16.029 Virginia Heath: white women writing Poc characters. So, Francis, any advice. 239 00:46:17.610 --> 00:46:31.839 Frances Mensah Williams: the honour of the school of thought that as a writer you can write whatever you like. but be ready when you write whatever you like, people to critique it. and if you feel that you understand, and can 240 00:46:32.210 --> 00:46:40.839 Frances Mensah Williams: present in your writing a character that isn't something that you know it doesn't, has an experience. You don't have. 241 00:46:41.150 --> 00:46:52.119 Frances Mensah Williams: Go with it. But if people tear it apart and say, that doesn't make sense, that's not true, then, you know, be ready to deal with that. So I don't believe in censoring people. But 242 00:46:52.390 --> 00:46:55.080 Frances Mensah Williams: you know we all we all need to write. Well. 243 00:46:55.160 --> 00:47:09.759 Virginia Heath: do. Your research is has point one there. Make sure that you actually have some understanding of it before you just launch in and think you know it, Leila, any advice, as far as your concern for people writing. 244 00:47:09.830 --> 00:47:18.870 Laila Rafi: which is what Francis said. You've got to do your research talk to people. You'll be surprised at how much you already do actually know, because 245 00:47:18.900 --> 00:47:43.820 Laila Rafi: there is a lot of information you take in through your day to day life. So there is a lot you already do know. But it's more about those finer points. It's those nuances that you want to make sure you're hitting to make your character seem authentic and genuine, because that's what every reader wants to do is have that relatable character. And if they do something that's slightly off, people are gonna drop right out of your book away from that character. They're not no longer gonna be able to relate. 246 00:47:43.850 --> 00:48:05.190 Laila Rafi: So you wanna make sure you're hitting those nuances. And the best thing to do is once you've written it, maybe give it to a sensitivity, reader, or somebody, maybe of that color, or of that background and and see what what their feedback is, and use that to work on it for sure. 247 00:48:05.420 --> 00:48:10.520 Frances Mensah Williams: I don't want to over egg this, because sometimes, you know, you can be black and British. 248 00:48:10.570 --> 00:48:20.269 Frances Mensah Williams: and we will have more in common with a white British woman that's got the same background as you. So it's not necessarily that everything to do with color is different. 249 00:48:20.350 --> 00:48:49.650 Virginia Heath: Yeah, no, absolutely, very, very good point. I've got a bunch of questions here that are all about the Rna. So if the panel don't mind seeing as I'm a director, I shall answer them, Tara said. How much thanks so much about. Tell us about the new writer screen who evaluates your manuscript or events, all in the Uk. I'm in Belgium. Okay? So the Nws. The new writer scheme what your manuscript will anonymously be appraised by someone who writes in a similar genre to you. 250 00:48:49.650 --> 00:49:04.229 Virginia Heath: and you'll never know who they are unless they out yourself, which they probably will when you get a publication deal, and they're going so glad that book made it because I was your reader. So it's anonymously done. And we have, you know. 251 00:49:04.240 --> 00:49:13.330 Virginia Heath: about 600 published members that that and and several 100 of those work in the new artist scheme a pricing manuscript. So 252 00:49:13.740 --> 00:49:28.830 Virginia Heath: we don't say who it is, but it's somebody writes in your genre are all the events in the Uk, I'm in Belgium. Currently, yeah, we'll have physical events in the Uk. However, we do have a lively online community. We do have a Europe online chapter. 253 00:49:28.830 --> 00:49:52.450 Virginia Heath: and we're hoping soon to open a Us online chapter, because we did find with all the problems with the America. There's a bit of a void. People were looking for different places. We do have quite a few America members. But actually, most of our physical events at the moment, but things could change are based in the Uk 254 00:49:52.750 --> 00:50:02.150 Virginia Heath: one here. Do you accept right to see right romance with subplots like fantasy, for example, or can it be vice versa? Or does romance have to be the main genre? 255 00:50:02.450 --> 00:50:07.130 Virginia Heath: Our our specification is that somewhere in your book is a love story. 256 00:50:07.290 --> 00:50:18.050 Virginia Heath: some form of love story. It could be a bromance, I suppose it could be. But something. There's always something in a story. Your whole story doesn't have to be about the romance. 257 00:50:18.150 --> 00:50:43.659 Virginia Heath: Does the new Rod scheme help with getting published in the Us. Well, I suppose it could do some of our authors all published in the Us. And did go through the Nws. So you'd have to talk to them about that. But yeah, the the Nws. Doesn't point you to a publisher. What it does is improve your manuscripts is when the publisher gets it. 258 00:50:43.790 --> 00:50:48.410 Virginia Heath: it's in a better state to be read. 259 00:50:48.570 --> 00:51:15.840 Virginia Heath: here's a question here. I always notice that romance is women is a woman. Women dominated world. I know that there are men who are romantic and are into romance as well. What is about women that makes us love and get into the romance the most? Oh, that's an interesting one. What is about romance that makes women love it and get into it the most. I'm gonna point that in the direction of Carrie. 260 00:51:16.340 --> 00:51:37.400 Carrie Elks: I think we love falling in love with men written by women, we we as as authors, we write way that we would maybe like them to be, and not always that they are. Ho! My husband's not listening. So it's all fine, happy Valentine's day, darling. But yeah, so I think there's something about that that 261 00:51:37.740 --> 00:51:46.100 Carrie Elks: that that draws us in. It was a little bit of a joke that we fall in love with men written by women, but they but it's also true, we do. So. 262 00:51:47.630 --> 00:51:56.700 Virginia Heath: Okay, I've got one here that says I'm almost done with my books and need to sell them. Soon. Got any advice for selling, publishing, editing. 263 00:51:56.710 --> 00:52:17.900 Virginia Heath: Okay, I'm gonna take that one first and then I'll throw it out. There is no quick route to publication. I wish, if I had a magic wand, for every time I'm asked that question, but I could wave it and say, Yes, this is what you need to do, but the truth is absolutely simple, and that is, you need to write a really good story. 264 00:52:18.630 --> 00:52:28.759 Virginia Heath: That's the only way it's going to get traditionally published. And that's the only way it's going to sell if it's independently published. So story is at the heart of it. 265 00:52:28.770 --> 00:52:33.570 Virginia Heath: Make sure you get your book edited. Make sure you have 266 00:52:33.640 --> 00:52:53.799 Virginia Heath: Beta. Readers who couldn't give you pointers and tips on how to approve improve it. Listen to advice, send it off to some industry, professional, some agents, some editors see what they come back with and improve it. It will not sell if it's no good, and that's the truth. Has anyone got anything they'd like to add to that, Sue. 267 00:52:54.500 --> 00:53:09.679 Sue Moorcroft: I think that when you are looking you can obviously have written the best book in the world, but if it doesn't land on the desk of an editor or agent who has space for it on their list. You will just get a very regretful, rave rejection. 268 00:53:09.870 --> 00:53:13.270 Sue Moorcroft: and I have had plenty of those in my life. 269 00:53:13.710 --> 00:53:24.760 Sue Moorcroft: The bookseller, which is an industry. Magazine, the the the publishing industry, the publishing Industries magazine, like, publishes weekly in America. 270 00:53:24.940 --> 00:53:36.209 Sue Moorcroft: It gives you a free newsletter every day. and that carries quite a lot of information. I mean, you can. You can subscribe to the magazine if you've got the dosh to invest. 271 00:53:36.220 --> 00:53:44.690 Sue Moorcroft: But that free newsletter gives you information on the movement sometimes of editors and agents, and they might even say what they're looking for. 272 00:53:44.770 --> 00:54:00.319 Sue Moorcroft: and you might see it like today. There was a legend, Times publisher has just re just started a new imprint called Serendipity. So obviously, they're looking for authors and Felicity Bryan associates 273 00:54:01.010 --> 00:54:09.920 Sue Moorcroft: their new voices scheme for underrepresented authors is concentrating on love stories this year. 274 00:54:10.200 --> 00:54:23.530 Sue Moorcroft: So that's 2 opportunities just from one Newsletter, and I know it's sent Valentine's Day. So that kind of skewed things. But if you look out for people who are just starting a list or just starting a new imprint. You're increasing your chances. 275 00:54:24.390 --> 00:54:34.159 Virginia Heath: Good answer, and also, you know, join the new writers. Scheme, get your work critiqued by people who know what they're talking about, you know. That's 276 00:54:34.350 --> 00:54:36.200 Virginia Heath: key. Yes, Francis. 277 00:54:36.800 --> 00:54:41.290 Frances Mensah Williams: I just wanted to add as well. I mean, I've self published 3 books, and 278 00:54:41.310 --> 00:54:53.160 Frances Mensah Williams: for me. I think it. It comes back to what Carrie was saying about quality and what you were saying about quality, because, you know, with self publishing. You still treat it as a book 279 00:54:53.570 --> 00:55:04.229 Frances Mensah Williams: in the real sense, as a traditional publisher would do, and I hired a really good editor. I got a really good cover designer, and I sat and really thought about the marketing plan. 280 00:55:04.770 --> 00:55:06.290 Frances Mensah Williams: So 281 00:55:06.410 --> 00:55:14.310 Frances Mensah Williams: you do have that option to go your own way independently. But if you do treat it as professionally as if you were getting 282 00:55:14.440 --> 00:55:17.150 Frances Mensah Williams: you know one of the big 5 looking after you. 283 00:55:17.970 --> 00:55:29.359 Sue Moorcroft: Yeah. Somebody just asked in the chat for the name of the newsletter again, if you go to the bookseller.com, you can sign up for their newsletter there. 284 00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:42.840 Virginia Heath: Okay, brilliant. Okay, so I'm gonna there's a question popped up for me now to be really quick and easy to answer. How did Virginia get into writing for meals and boon. And how many books have you written for them now? I submitted 285 00:55:43.650 --> 00:56:06.140 Virginia Heath: th 3, 4 books. They like the full book, the fourth book. Finally, because obviously I'd managed to finally get something right with all the other disasters that went before it. And I've now written 28 for them now. But my main publishers. Now, some multis in the Us. And I've written another 5 for them so far. 286 00:56:06.240 --> 00:56:16.760 Virginia Heath: Let's see if a oh question for Leila. How did you start? Did you send your manuscript out to an agent, or directly to a publisher? What was your writing? Journey? 287 00:56:17.990 --> 00:56:23.150 Laila Rafi: Well, thank you for that question. I went to 288 00:56:23.170 --> 00:56:49.060 Laila Rafi: the Rna Conference and it was through that I had a one to one with an editor who I had already sent my first chapter to, and after they had read my chapter we had a quick 10 min chat, and they said they really liked it, and they'd like to see the full manuscript. So I polished it up. Luckily it was ready to go, but I polished it up making sure I was absolutely happy with it, and sent it to them, and they loved it, and they took it up 289 00:56:49.140 --> 00:56:53.839 Virginia Heath: brilliantly. The second part is, what was your journey? How did you get to that point? 290 00:56:54.110 --> 00:56:58.199 Laila Rafi: I started off writing as a hobby to be fair. 291 00:56:58.410 --> 00:57:09.270 Laila Rafi: What about 6 years ago, or something? Took it more seriously. During all the lockdowns I had lots of free time, so I was like, well, I quite enjoy this. I'll do more of it. And 292 00:57:09.610 --> 00:57:29.630 Laila Rafi: Virginia is actually my mentor, and I got in touch with her. And I'm doing this. What do you think? And she's like, Yeah, you you're alright. But you can do better, so she's helped me coach me push me through this and manage to drag me through and get me a publishing deal. Which I'm very, very grateful for. Thank you. Virginia. 293 00:57:30.970 --> 00:57:44.560 Laila Rafi: Yeah. So that would that was it, really. I've I had quite a few failed attempts which we won't really talk about. But when I did actually knuckle down and take it more seriously, during those lockdowns I just focused on improving my craft. 294 00:57:44.740 --> 00:57:49.919 Laila Rafi: doing what all the expert said to do. And here I am. 295 00:57:50.180 --> 00:58:07.549 Virginia Heath: Okay. So Hayley's back on now. So we've got a whistle. Stop. Yeah. So okay, very quickly. Can you all? I'm gonna say your name remind everyone who you are, what you write and where they can find you on social media. And I shall start with Carrie 296 00:58:07.640 --> 00:58:14.449 Carrie Elks: Carrie Elks. I write contemporary romance, and you can find me probably on Tiktok, on Facebook and my website. 297 00:58:14.520 --> 00:58:16.130 Virginia Heath: okay, Sue 298 00:58:16.590 --> 00:58:25.049 Sue Moorcroft: Seymourcroft. I'm on seymorcroft.com, and all kinds of social media, and I write 2 seasonal contemporary romances a year. 299 00:58:25.990 --> 00:58:26.990 Virginia Heath: Francis 300 00:58:27.270 --> 00:58:40.949 Frances Mensah Williams: Hi, Francis Mensa williams.com. I write contemporary romance and featuring diverse characters and diverse leading ladies. Social media handle at Francis Mensa, W. 301 00:58:41.820 --> 00:58:43.369 Virginia Heath: Brilliant and Leila 302 00:58:43.530 --> 00:58:51.009 Laila Rafi: Leila Rafi. I write contemporary romantic comedies, and I am best found on Instagram at Leila Rafi, author. 303 00:58:51.640 --> 00:59:06.140 Virginia Heath: And I am Ginny, he all right, slightly racy regency, romantic comedies. And you can find me on Facebook and Instagram as Virginia Heath loathe Twitter with a passion. She won't find me there, and I don't understand tik Tok. 304 00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:35.260 Hayley @ ProWritingAid: Thanks for joining us. Yeah, thank you all so much for joining us. This was so much fun. And I will be adding to the hub the links to everyone's books so that you can find them and check them out. And or if you've misplaced links to their websites, etc., you can see them there. But thank you again, everyone this was, this is so fun! I looked up, and I was like, Oh, my! Gosh! The hours over that one so quickly! So thank you again. And we'll see everyone at the next session. Bye, now.